• MithranArkanere@lemmy.world
      8·
      3 days ago

      I was thinking that another exception would be those who open their eyes and leave it behind, but then they are no longer fascists. So you could say their old fascist self is essentially dead too.

      So while I do prefer this method as some ex-fascists may turn into anti-fascist advocates, and we can always use more help against fascism, it still doesn’t really counter the adage.

      • BreadOven@lemmy.world
        1·
        3 days ago

        I agree that people can (and hopefully do) change their mindset in regards to fascism. Those that do may turn out as you mentioned, advocating against it.

        I just don’t have faith anymore in that happening anytime soon (although I really hope people see what’s going on and change it).

        Also my original message is a title of a song by Propaghandi. I would recommend it if you’re into more hardcore-esque punk.

        I’m still hoping and doing what little I can in the meantime.

    • kameecoding@lemmy.world
      41·
      5 days ago

      No they are fascists, Nazi was the shorthand for Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei (NSDAP), the first 4 letters.

      Fascism gets its name from Italy, Mussolini’s Fascist Party, but it is the name for the political ideology as a whole, there is no Nazism and Americans being called Nazis is kinda weird, imagine if the scenario was flipped and you called german fascists MAGAs.

      Thanks for coming to my stickler talk.

      • prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
        35·
        5 days ago

        If the situation were flipped, and Hitler was rising to power ~80 years after we had a massive war to take out MAGA fascists, then yeah I think people would refer to them as “MAGA”, at least at first.

        Nazi means refers to National Socialist, but at this point in history, it can also just refer to political movements that are fascist and Nazi-like. The meanings of words shift over time.

        Edit: Fixed to appease a pedant.

        • kameecoding@lemmy.world
          3·
          5 days ago

          Nazi doesn’t mean national socialist, as I said it’s literally just the first 4 letters, a shorthand a nickname, American version for Republicans would be Repu/Repus.

          Lots of people I have seen that think it’s Nazi because the Sozialistische has the Zi, it’s nonsense, Nazional is how germans pronounce National, hence it’s shortened to Nazi.

            • monogram@feddit.nlEnglish
              5·
              4 days ago

              You are confusing National Socialism with Leftist-Nationalism

              The reason Hitler added Social to their party name was because it was political suicide not to, not because they where socialists.

          • aesthelete@lemmy.world
            1·
            5 days ago

            I call them Repubs at this point because they don’t want to say things like “Democratic politicians” opting instead for “Democrat politicians” because they’re worried democratic sounds too good.

            I think republican sounds too good. They don’t want a republic, they want a tyrant.

      • Humana@lemmy.world
        17·
        5 days ago

        I don’t live in America, and many people here actually do use MAGA or Trumpism to describe the local right wing people and parties because they are largely just copying America…

      • BussyCat@lemmy.world
        9·
        4 days ago

        What do you call people who wear red and black swastikas and say heil Hitler while doing a salute typical of the Nazi party?

      • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.worldEnglish
        10·
        5 days ago

        imagine if the scenario was flipped and you called german fascists MAGAs.

        It’s semantics. The German and American fascists all pull from the same ideological and rhetorical playbook.

        Veneration of the national security state. Zealous religious orthodoxy. Obsession with loyalty oaths and ethnicity sorting. Reflexive xenophobia. Institutionalized quackery.

        It’s all the same shit. Same as Apartheid Africa. Same as Kuomanting China. Same as Pinochet’s Chile and Milei’s Argentina.

          • uniquethrowagay@feddit.org
            3·
            4 days ago

            I am German. We don’t call it that. Nobody says Nazipartei, it’s NSDAP. Nazi Party is an English expression and has nothing to do with the etymology of the word Nazi.

            Nazi is short for Nationalsozialist. https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi (the english version of this article points to the ideology of nazism, the original is about the term. Use a translator if you’re interested.)

            It was coined in the 1920s and it’s not an American term. You call the party Nazi Party because it was the party of the nazis, not the other way around.

  • MangioneDontMiss@feddit.nl
    23·
    4 days ago

    fuck that. I wish harm on fascists. lots of it. so much harm that other fascists are scared to even be associated with the word.

    • TeddE@lemmy.world
      4·
      4 days ago

      That’s step two or three, for sure. But the point being made is fascist isn’t a word that can be applied to anyone and everyone (setting aside the 2¢ insult version) - it is a specific political ideology that one earns by their words and actions.

      Unfortunately it is also complex to diagnose, particularly in early stages, especially as intelligent budding fascists will deliberately evade the formal definitions while still finding ways to accomplish similar effects.

      But yes - there’s also cases where fascists clearly and obviously are doing fascist things, and need to be stopped immediately, please feel free to give them a proper knuckle sandwich (or an appropriate grade of violence as the situation warrants)

  • NutWrench@lemmy.mlEnglish
    8·
    4 days ago

    If you look like a fascist and talk like a fascist and act like a fascist you are probably a freaking fascist and that’s the way people are going to deal with you until you give them evidence to the contrary.

    • InputZero@lemmy.world
      4·
      4 days ago

      Just be more careful than Santa. He only checks his list twice cause the worst punishment he gives is a lump of coal. The guillotine is a lot more absolute in its punishment.

    • M137@lemmy.world
      1·
      3 days ago

      I love the channel too, but I haven’t watched any of it for about a year. I just don’t have the mental energy to get that into so many topics that, while they’re objectively bad, don’t apply much to me as a non-american. Just the daily reading of posts from lemmy and the grounded app, both worldwide and local to me can be too much some days. It sucks cause I like the show and podcast, and love their humor, but there’s not really any way to interact with it without diving deep into fucked up shit.

  • Knightfox@lemmy.world
    4·
    3 days ago

    Let me start by saying I’m 100% against fascism, but… we do have a terminology problem. The left overall has a messaging problem, “Oh Black lives matter, so that means White lives don’t?!?” Words do matter, but it’s because they matter that we have a problem. The left seems to ebb and flow on vibes (“Just because we say Black lives matter doesn’t mean other people’s lives don’t”) while the right seems so much more literal, but the subtext is maybe even more implied. For example, they might say “They [people not like us] are taking our jobs,” but what they really mean is that they are taking the jobs we want (office jobs, trade jobs, etc), but we don’t mind them working the jobs we don’t want (basic construction, farm hands, etc), all the while their vibe is wrong and that’s not really happening.

    When you call someone or something fascist they probably won’t believe you because fascism equals Nazis which equals antisemitism in most of the common people’s view. I’ll assume that anyone who has found their way to Lemmy probably understands the difference, but at the same time many of this platform don’t seem able to understand that the common person doesn’t know the difference.

    There is a big difference between systemic racism vs open bigotry. A bigot is much harder to turn from racism than a person who grew up in systemic racism. It still might take decades to turn someone who is systemically racist, but a bigot will likely take longer. The same applies to a fascist; like a systemic racist they might not understand that they are racist or what racism even is. Education or experience are the two avenues people escape those avenues, but it’s especially hard if you’re doing it alone and if you feel attacked by the terminology.

    Fascist = Nazi = Jew hater

    “Well, I don’t hate jews, I’m not a Nazi, so I’m not a fascist” -common Fascist

    I’ve had plenty of discussions with Conservatives where I took the discussion to a rich vs poor direction or a a personal rights vs governed rights direction and they suddenly become liberals without acknowledging it.

    Honestly it’s the same hurdle that the left has had for decades, just because you’re a leftist doesn’t mean you love Stalin and Mao. Messaging is important, one of the most recent persons to break that mold was Bernie Sanders who made it at least semi acceptable to be a Democratic Socialist.

  • qarbone@lemmy.worldEnglish
    39·
    5 days ago

    Oh! This is the guy who talked about what a shithead Fetterman was even before the stroke! I could never find it again but I remember his face.

  • joan@lemmy.world
    12·
    4 days ago

    They don’t mean anything anymore… Seen people on here calling everything from Joe Biden to Buffalo wild wings fascist… (real encounters)