Ok, then explain prefix and postfix, where these conventions don’t apply

The conventions don’t apply, the rules still apply. Maths notation and the rules of Maths aren’t the same thing.

How can these be rules of math when they didn’t universally apply?

The rules do universally apply 🙄

The order of operations tells us how to interpret an equation without rearranging it

Yep, and you showed you don’t know the rules 🙄

When you pick a different convention, you need to rearrange it to get the same answer

Not necessarily, though it makes it easier (but also leads a lot of people to make mistakes with signs, as you found out 😂 )

What you did was rearrange the equation

To show you how to correctly do “Multiplication first”. 🙄

which you can only do if you are already following a specific convention

Which you didn’t, hence why you ended up with a wrong answer. 🙄 There is no textbook which says put the multiplication in Brackets if doing “Multiplication first”, none.

because the conventions are not laws of mathematics, they are conventions

And putting the Multiplication inside Brackets isn’t a convention anywhere 🙄

They obey the laws of math. Conventions aren’t laws of math, they’re conventions

Yep, and you ignored both, hence your wrong answer 🙄

And a quick Google search will tell you that not everyone puts juxtaposition at a higher precedent than multiplication

And a quick look in the Google support forum will show you many people telling them that is wrong, and Google just closes the incident 🙄

it’s a convention

No it isn’t. It’s against the rules. 🙄 Again, you won’t find this alleged “convention” in any Maths textbook

As long as people are using the same convention, they’ll agree on an answer and that answer is correct

Unless they disobeyed the rules, in which case they are all wrong 🙄

You can be mean all you like, that doesn’t change the nature of conventions

And you can be as ignorant of the rules and conventions of Maths as much as you want, and it’s not going to change that your answer is wrong 🙄

So if you have one “notation definition” as you call it which says that 2+2*3 means ”first add two to two, then multiply by three" and another which says “first multiply two by three, then add it to two”, why on earth do the “rules” have anything further to say about order of operations?

I explained why here

And you were proven wrong elsewhere (since you ran your rubbish to the maximum comment depth), but admitted to not reading it, speaking of proving you were the bad faith one all along 🙄

So, now that I’ve found a place I can reply to your other non-repliable posts…

Even if you corner them on something

Which no-one ever has 🙄

they absolutely will not budge

See how many Mathematicians and Maths teachers you can gaslight into believing that they and Maths textbooks are all wrong, I’ll wait.

I like many others brought up calculators and how common basic calculators only evaluate from left to right

And you hilariously provided a manual that proved you were wrong about that! 😂

He asserted (without evidence) that the first does not operate in this way

It’s right there in the manual, as I pointed out 😂

even though the manual says that you must re-order some expressions so that bracketed sub-expressions come first

That’s right, because it doesn’t have brackets keys 🙄 So you have to enter that first, then press the equals key to make it evaluate that first, because it doesn’t evaluate from left to right otherwise, it will do the multiplication first 🙄

still will not admit that he was wrong about his claim

says person who still will not admit he was wrong about his claim that all basic calculators working that way, even though the manual proves there are some that don’t 😂

you will not convince him of anything no matter what the evidence is

Says person refusing to believe all evidence, including the calculator manual 😂

he fundamentally cannot separate mathematics from the notation

Nope liar. I’m the one who keeps pointing out they are different 🙄 Go ahead and find a screenshot of me saying they’re the same, I’ll wait

He calls a×b multiplication and ab a product.

As per Maths textbooks, which you keep ignoring 🙄

These are, of course, the exact same thing

says person who not only can’t give a single textbook which says that, but refused to answer my question about

For a=2, b=3

1/ab=1/(2x3)=1/6

1/axb=1/2x3=3/2

which of those, according to you, is the correct answer, given you insist they are “the same thing” 🙄

implicit multiplication

There’s no such thing. Go ahead and find a Maths textbook that says so, I’ll wait

ab can, by some conventions, have a higher precedence than does the explicit multiplication in a×b

Literally always does, as per the rules of Maths, as found in Maths textbooks 🙄

he has taken that to mean that they are fundamentally different

So go ahead and explain how “the same thing”, according to you, can give different answers in all textbooks. I’ll wait

He thinks that a(b+c)=ab+bc is something to do with notation

The Distributive Law actually, another rule of Maths 🙄

not a fundamental relationship between multiplication and addition

There’s no multiplication in The Distributive Law, only in The Distributive Property 🙄

I will say that no author would distinguish those two terms

Except, of course, for all the ones who do 😂

because they’re just too easily confused

says person confused about the difference between a Law and a Property 😂

And many authors explicitly say that one is also known as the other

says person who can’t even cite a single example of such

He says that a×(b+c) = ab + bc is an instance of the “distributive property”

ax(b+c)=axb+axc actually.

You seem to think notation is only correct at exactly the level you claim to teach

Nope, every level after Primary school

Elementary school children get taught parentheses means you do stuff inside parentheses first

Because they haven’t been taught The Distributive Law yet, and there is no outside brackets for them - they don’t learn that until Year 7

college calculus students get taught parentheses mean you do stuff inside parenthesis first

No they don’t.

despite two centuries of textbooks showing that is in fact how parentheses work

You’re the one ignoring the 2 centuries of textbooks dude 😂

All published textbooks and all pragmatic mathematics operate as though your pet peeve does not exist

says person who can’t cite a single such example, again 🙄

It’s almost like the shit you insist upon is completely made-up, and does not matter to anyone besides you

says person who actually made up that Multiplication and Products are the same thing 🙄

I thought they were called “products” not “multiplications”

That’s right. You know you’re referring to a 1912 textbook, right? Terminology has moved on since then, as demonstrated by the 1965 textbook 😂

I’m just trying to give you more opportunities to prove that you’re not just a troll

says person who ignored all the textbooks I posted, whilst not citing any themselves 🙄

You insist you’re talking about mathematical rules that cannot be violated, so it should be no problem to find an explicit mention of them

I provided many, which you ignored 🙄

you are saying that the practice of calculators, mathematical tools, programming languages and mathematical software are all wrong

Nope, liar. All my calculators give correct answers (Sharp, Casio, Omron - only Texas Instruments breaks the mold these days), and programmers disobeying the rules of Maths doesn’t prove they not rules of Maths. 🙄 You are the one claiming that Sharp and Casio calculators are giving wrong answers. 🙄 I’m guessing that your calculator, if you even have one (which seems doubtful from what I’ve seen) is a Texas Instruments one.

that you are right

My caclulators and textbooks are correct, yes. 🙄

that my interpretation of your own textbooks is wrong

says person who read one sentence and stopped there and did some mental gymnastics with it, ignoring that the whole rest of the book contradicts that interpretation 🙄

if you show no ability to admit error

says the person who actually made errors.

admit that disagreement from competing authorities

There isn’t any “disagreement from competing authorities”. 😂 Every single textbook, not just Maths, but Physics, Chemistry, Engineering, etc., obeys the exact same rules 😂

As my own show of good faith, I

didn’t look at any of the examples about Distribution and Terms, speaking of proving you are the bad faith person 🙄

I’ll explain why I think this is a bad convention

and you would be wrong, just like you are about everything else

why the formal first-order language of arithmetic doesn’t have this convention

No-one cares why a niche topic, only taught at University, is different to the general rules taught to everyone at high school 🙄

the distributive law is something you must do instead of a property of multiplication that you can use to aid in the manipulation of algebraic expressions but don’t have to

That’s right, as per Maths textbooks

Folded into their inability to understand that some aspects of maths are custom and convention

Says person who has an inability to tell the difference between a convention and the rules 🙄

Somewhere along the way he seems to think that distributivity is something to do with brackets instead of something to do with addition and multiplication

Law Vs. Property, not complicated!

if I can get him to actually cop to any of his verifiable mistakes

Of which there are none as opposed to you who has several verifiable mistakes 🙄

back up any of his whackadoodle claims with direct references

You’ve been given them, and you ignored them

Tomorrow I’m expecting another wall of text responding to every single word except the ones where I ask for such an admission

says person who has still failed to show anywhere that I was mistaken 🙄 On the other hand you have refused to admit to your mistakes

I’ll have satisfied myself he’s a lost cause

Actually, you admitted to not even reading it - that’s something which people who know they are wrong do 🙄

been pushing his wrong ideas of what the distributive law are, since 2023

says person again ignoring the Maths textbooks 🙄

Notice how the text never says “you MUST use the distributive law”?

I notice how you have comprehension and/or honesty issues

It always says some variation of “in order to simplify, you must…”?

Which part of the word “must” don’t you understand? 😂 Also, which part of simplifying Brackets is part of the order of operations don’t you understand? 😂

No, you don’t notice, because you’re blind

cough cough 😂 Here’s another one, in case you’re still in any doubt…

don’t understand what distributivity actually is.

says the person who actually doesn’t understand what The Distributive Law is

You also got me confused with someone else trying to explain in short words how you’re wrong

Nope. Tweedle Dum and Tweedle Dee say very similar things, but one can still tell them apart.

bye

Don’t let the door hit you on the way out! 😂

Yikes

You have a masters but you can’t differentiate between notation and the concept it is trying to convey