He quietly urged other military personnel to reflect on their own positions. “They should be confident in questioning possibly immoral or illegal orders,” he said, “remembering they are responsible for their own actions, and knowing others are asking the same questions.”
“If they have doubts about their orders, they are not alone,”
All these comments are telling him to stay and fight, but they’re ignoring that could be devastating to his family.
He’s over the 20 year mark and can retire. If he stays and gets a dishonorable discharge, his family gets none of his retirement, no medical, and a family member with financial mobility akin to a felon.
What would you do in that situation?
I don’t think I’d be willing to put my family through that. We don’t have enough in the bank to take a blow like that. I’d probably do what he did. Try to fight another way.
He’s read SunTzu. He knows a good strategy sometimes is to be safe.
I hope he can move with his family out of range of the re-activation order.
Bullies and fascists do not stop unless they are forced to stop. If every american capitulates like this, then we are lost.
This is what it means to fight for country and freedom. It’s not just words in a country music song. Standing up for your beliefs sometimes means real risk and sacrifice.
If the armed forces want to be recognized for their service and sacrifice, this is how its done.
It’s not that Americans can’t and will not fight, it’s that half the population is illiterate. How do you fight 175 million neighbors?
Something like 50% of humans are hard wired to follow their gut. They rely on fairh, authority, and feelings to guide their everyday descision making. They do not live their lives based on facts or logic. If they believe something, then, its true.
Right wing media takes full advantage of this. They spent 40 years making people “feel” a certain way.
So, to answer your question, I think we need to stop the constant flow of poison flowing into their ears. The poison needs to be replaced with a better message.
I generally agree with you, but it flows both ways. And I know we hate this whole both sides thing, and I generally agree, but all news is propaganda these days, it feels like. The constant message I try to spread is to think micro. Stop taking on these world problems and try to solve a problem more locally, try to take an action that you can physically take with your own hands. I firmly believe that stronger communities make a stronger nation.
I live in a place where elections are upcoming, and I see signs of the opposition, but I try to think of these people first and foremost as my neighbors. I truly think that solves a lot of problems, because while the right is thinking of everyone on the left as criminals, the left is painting anyone on the right as Nazi fascists, and this in and of itself is a problem. The other side is not inherently wrong. There is no one correct way to do things. We’re all fumbling through life, nobody knows what theyre doing, lets try to do it without being afraid of each other.
Death and imprisonment, and collective punishment of wife and child. Are not a ask a sane person asks of any man unless the alternative is death.
Could be even worse, look at what happened to Stauffenberg’s family.
Arguable whether he signed up for that.
Fight and die in defence of a NATO ally? Yes. Same as the aggressor, if the elected government decides so, such as in Iraq? Also yes.
Risk having his wife, children, grandchildren taken away and put in Sippenhaft (collective punishment) or put in a reeducation orphanage? Not sure there is a moral obligation to that. Safety for his family was one of the things he got out of all this.
His risks for resisting beyond what he already did are higher than they would be for the average citizen. On the other hand, he also could do more than the average citizen.
A tough call, and I would not judge.
He made the problem worse?
He’s been there long enough for retirement. If he fought Trump he’d be dishonorably discharged and lose all retirement pay, all medical benefits, and you’ll have a record that is equivalent to having a felony.
By quitting now he’s ensuring the welfare of his family.
The statement stands because by the time the military turn on Trump properly (if they ever do) we can’t just assume they’d fail.
They’re one of the few groups capable of intervening.
Like that could stop Trump at this point. He do it and DOJ would just watch.
Fascists having less competent soldiers is far from worse, hopefully more and more walk away.
Now is a great time, too, since they’re not getting paid and if any of them are laid off the Trump admin has stated they won’t recieve backpay, which the Trump admin has confirmed is the plan.
While in service, he is bound by duty to follow orders that are legal… and the Supreme Court said anything the President does is legal. Once out of service, he can choose to follow his own conscious and fight how he sees fit.
I’m praying for a military coup, and for all these Nazi Republicans to be hung Mussolini style at a Buck ees.
In the meantime I’m putting on this frog suit and dancing in the streets.
You can’t when all the reasonable people quit.
I don’t think you realize what kinds of people are in the US military. Be careful what you wish for.
I don’t think you realize that the US military is a pretty fair representation of the civilian populations. I served with dudes who came in all shapes, sizes, and affiliations. You’re talking about 3+ million active and reserve members, and the law of averages works the same in and out.
We need him to stay in, and fight the good fight, not quit. WTF?
Come January 2028, we might very well need our military leaders to uphold the Constitution they took an oath to protect, and kick the bastards out of the White House.
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We need him to stay in, and fight the good fight, not quit. WTF?
If you’re waiting for an officer’s revolt, don’t hold your breath.
2029
People say this a lot but the overwhelmingly more likely result of him staying is him just sitting there and watching things happen.
Then why the fuck do you quit, freely giving up your important position so that gop can put a useful idiot there?
Because they can put you in military jail for disobeying a direct order. Man probably has a family he needs to feed. Military jail is not like civilian jail. UCMJ doesn’t fuck around, and UCMJ being wielded by this administration is probably going to equal a bad time.
People in his command see this. Shit, we see this here. But his resigning has an impression on people, which may unfortunately be the only effect he can make. The whole unlawful orders thing is a sticky situation at best, and what all of us here in this tiny echo chamber believe is not what is reflected in the real world, and so some stand he may take may end up unseen and unheard while he rots away as an O-1 in Leavenworth.
Same with when Mattis was fired back in term one. Sometimes the only statement you can make is your resignation.
exactly, this shit pisses me off.
Stop taking a fucking moral stand and quititng. all you’re doing it is making it easier for puppets to get placed without having to go through the effort and legal issue of baselessly firing you.
Given that this is the only way military members can legally protest I am glad to see this sort of action.
So that a fascist can take his place? Weird way to protest.
They can either resign publicly or be confined privately. This way we know about it, we see members of leadership taking a stand. And for each one that resigns I’m confident there are others who rebel secretly in whatever ways they can. We saw the commanding general of ORNG give his press conference about protecting the protestors. It’s a fine line they walk, and in this day and age, with the required credentialing for news agencies at the Pentagon, you might just not hear about Colonel So-and-so who defied an order.
Feel free to take his place.
Oh, of course, with my US citizenship that I have lying around here somewhere, and my decades of experience in the US military. Will do.
Excellent plan!
Will do just for you, pumpkin. You’re so smart.
Please, you’re going to make me blush.
How is quitting the answer? Someone else will become the yes man.
Jail time for disobeying, as per UCMJ.
There’s a difference between disobeying and incompetence.
No it’s not and really has never been really. In a magical ideal world it is, but the real world just ain’t like that.
Jesus fucking Christ you fuckers in here saying “what he quit for” should read the fucking article.
The guy resigned to shine a light on the current administration, but all you can do is say “why he quit tho?”If he hadn’t have quit you’d be calling him a lackey or stooge, but when he does resign AND uses it to call out tRUMP you still think he’s done the wrong thing!!
For fuck sake, take the win. Point at this guy and his message and use it. Christ.
A nation of quitters, capitulators, and oath breakers.
America the brave, my dick.
Malicious compliance would be better in most cases
