Fuck no. Full EU or stay out.
Why? Ireland isn’t in Schengen, and multiple EU countries aren’t using the euro, with no plans to adopt it (Poland, Sweden, Hungary, Czechia).
I’m British and I hope the UK and EU can have closer relations. But if the EU just wants to punish the UK for Brexit then that is going to go down badly with many Brits, so closer relations will become less likely.
Because objectively, the brits had one of if not the best deal out of any EU country, lots of excemptions, rebates, special cases for them. But that wasnt enough, so they threw a tantrum and left.
It is wildly inappropriate and sends the wrong message to everyone else if UK gets to join at yet again super favourable cherry picked conditions. The EU should take them back as a true and full member only, not as this privileged cherry picked BS again that only stirs resentment from others. Commit fully to the EU like every other member and the trust is restored.
Not this.
But that wasn’t enough, so they threw a tantrum and left.
I don’t think it was necessarily just greed and racism that caused Brexit. There were a lot of people that weren’t happy with life in the UK, and a huge misinformation campaign cropped up at the wrong time to suggest Brexit would leave people better off and provide more money for the NHS.
I think what didn’t help is when there were celebs who weren’t struggling like everyone else were saying people would be stupid not to vote stay.
The misinformation campaign worked and a lot of those people that voted leave realised how they had been misled.
They had freedom of movement if they wanted to live anywhere else.
All of those millions for the NHS that was just a lie and we all only got told it was a lie afterwards. And we basically had people on the leave side admitting to just making numbers up.
Did you punish those people for lying? Or did the society (and their laws) decide that it was an ok thing to do?
No of course not, they just keep letting them get away with it because they are all getting paid by the same people arent they, its all just a game to them im sure
But if the EU just wants to punish the UK for Brexit then that is going to go down badly with many Brits, so closer relations will become less likely.
Being treated like every other new country wanting to join isn’t a punishment. The “British exceptionalism” mentality imho causing these thoughts is one root of the problem.
A punishment would be if the EU were to demand reparations for the economic damages the UK inflicted on it. Which, you’ll note, nobody is asking for.
The British had their chance. No getting two bites at the apple their way.
I’m not talking about British exceptionalism in any way. Clearly lots of people in this thread don’t like the UK. Fine. That doesn’t mean you should twist my words though.
Multiple EU countries haven’t adopted the euro and don’t show signs of adopting it. So clearly the EU already practises “flexibility” on the euro, to some degree.
If EU citizens decide they don’t want the UK in the EU, okay. I would like good UK-EU relations, but I can’t control what EU citizens think of the UK.
I’m not talking about British exceptionalism in any way. Clearly lots of people in this thread don’t like the UK. Fine. That doesn’t mean you should twist my words though.
Your words are not being twisted as I’ll lay out below.
Multiple EU countries haven’t adopted the euro and don’t show signs of adopting it. So clearly the EU already practises “flexibility” on the euro, to some degree.
These countries enjoy the things the UK decided to reject when leaving: Special privileges for joining early enough.
New countries joining do not receive any such privileges anymore and neither should the UK. That is being treated fairly. Any position that wants the UK to be treated better than other new countries wanting to join is what I called British Exceptionalism.
If EU citizens decide they don’t want the UK in the EU, okay. I would like good UK-EU relations, but I can’t control what EU citizens think of the UK.
I’m fine with them joining on the same terms as every other new country. If they don’t want to join, there are plenty of ways to cooperate without that. Finally: I generally don’t tend to think of the UK at all (neither negatively or positively), unless it comes up in political topics.
The reason I mentioned “punish” is because that’s the sense I’m getting from the comments in this thread. A dislike of the UK. Not because of the joining standards people want for the UK. Obviously the UK should get the same joining terms as any other joining country. The “punish” attitude comes from comments in this thread, like the comment saying the UK hasn’t been relevant for 100 years. I could say the same thing about various EU countries, but I don’t want to, because I want good relations with EU countries.
Thankfully the EU itself seems to make reasonable comments on the UK these days, and I hope the UK and EU governments will find good ways to cooperate.
If you want to downvote me and tell me I’m a British exceptionalist bastard, go ahead.
Ireland only isn’t in Schengen to accommodate the UK not being in Schengen, by the way.
New members don’t get any opt outs. And if you think full membership is a punishment, just stay on your island and leave us alone.
It’s more like keeping their word. The UK was warned that rejoining would not include the same exceptions as before.
And UK is not Ireland, Poland or Sweden.
And Poland, Ireland or Sweden didn’t waste shitload of time and resource of EU by staging idiotic exit.
💯
No one learned anything.
If you’re implying that Brits are all a bunch of Europe-hating backstabbers then I don’t think that’s true. I’m British and yes, some Brits don’t like the EU. Mainly older Brits. But a lot of Brits do like the EU.
According to YouGov, a British polling company, a majority of Brits have wanted to rejoin the EU for at least the last two and a half years, perhaps longer. Of course that level of support could change depending on the terms of rejoining the EU, but still.
Personally I think it would be good if the UK and EU forge closer relations in the coming years, but I don’t think rejoining the EU will be a realistic possibility for at least a few years, because eurosceptics in the UK continue to wield political power.
Then join with the same rules as everyone else. Why should the UK get special treatment? It only contributes to British inflated sense of self-importance and exceptionalism, and creates problems inside the EU because once you start creating exceptions everyone wants them.
Countries should either be in or out, there shouldn’t be a special snowflake of a country that’s allowed to be in and out all at once just because they used to be relevant 100 years ago.
I didn’t ask at all for the UK to be treated as “a special snowflake”. Obviously the EU can set whatever joining terms they want to set.
used to be relevant 100 years ago
I could say the same thing about various EU countries if I wanted to, but I don’t want to, because I like EU countries and I hope for good UK-EU relations.
I think EU politicians these days are saying completely sensible things about the UK, but I get the sense from some people online (not all, thankfully) that they just don’t like the UK. Personally I hope the UK and EU can both be positive and have a good relationship.
You had your special deal, didn’t like it, why would we offer it again
A minority of peoples didn’t like it, imposing their will over the rest of the country, after months of propaganda stuffed down their throats that said every permutation of lie possible to convince them it would be a good idea.
Brexit is something to learn from, not punish. It could be your country next. Otherwise the EU will be torn apart by its enemies and unforgiving responses like this will keep the EU broken rather than healing its wounds.
🇪🇺
It wasn’t exactly a small minority, and the Bremaining voters apparently stayed home. I remember fondly Farage screaming for a 2/3s majority or it wouldn’t count, but boi was he suddenly happy with the more or less 3.5% difference for leave!
You’re not wrong, it was 1/4 of the population I believe. Which shows how at risk our populations are to misinformation and disinformation.
Brexit was a warning sign of the impact social media, social engineering, and charismatic yet morally bankrupt orators. Europe mustn’t be divided so easily nor allow grudges to perpetuate that division.
I’d be flexible on the Euro. And by flexible I mean “sure keep the £ for now, but you gotta commit to similar plans as the other non-€ having EU members” sort of thing. But only if thats the only deal breaker, like if they accept everything else, sure, let them keep the £ for a bit. But eventually it has to change.
As for Schengen, nah. That’s one of the main things about the EU, if you don’t want that, then stay out.
Ireland is not part of the schegen. “Islands are different”.
Oh hell no
The EU is truly enshittifying itself.
I am a Brit, writing this while on holiday in Portugal. Most of the year I live in Malaysia. No, I’m not rich, yes, I’m disappointed too. My penny’s worth:
- I’ve always subscribed to the European project and am ashamed of Brexit. I apologise to my European siblings that I wasn’t able to convince close family members to remain.
- East Asia is close to eating our collective breakfast, lunch and dinner. Brits, leave the past behind, it’s over. We still have many wonderful attributes to contribute to Europe. They and us are stronger together.
- Being the 51st state of America does not seem like a very good idea, at all.
- I’m just turning 60 and remember the current, decimal pound being introduced. It’s younger than me, it’s not something to be nostalgic about.
- It is the 21st century. Britain needs a governmental system appropriate for it, one that provides the greatest good for the greatest number of people. Our current system benefits the few and the legacy few at the expense of the many. Europe provides a better framework. I wish you all well but let’s pull our collective head out of our arse and get back into Europe, with humility, where we belong.
I agree with you. I’d love for the UK to rejoin the EU. But getting back together with humility means no preferential treatment. No exceptions
Well, that’s the same terms under which Denmark is a member. I think it’s acceptable.
However, Denmark participates in Schengen.
Theoretically, yes. However , since 2016 we’ve had ‘temporary border controls’ on the German and Swedish borders.
Edit: Utimately, the EU will be stronger with the UK back in. Militarily, economically, politically.
So let’s not be assholes about it - they were manipulated to leave, in part by Russian agents using the Cambridge Analytica data scandal to run political ads without informed consent, and also in part by their national politicians blaming everything bad on the EU for 50 years.
I think we’ve all learned from it, and I’d be happy to see them back in the EU.
I fear their direction on personal privacy. They are running a strong line toward US/Russia style oversight of people’s lives. Not to mention they have the most cctv in the world already, now they want to ban VPNs and push for IDs on all srvices.
Well, yes, but I also fear that from my own Danish government and many other governments in the EU. I still think the EU as a block will be stronger with the UK in instead of out.
Yes we will be economically and militarily. But militarily we have agreements already.
I don’t want to have desgrading return on investment in life because a line goes up somewhere for some dickhead and I am supposedly safer from a foreign enemy but I have now have a local enemy in my tech and home.
And were Denmark to leave EU and rejoin Denmark would no longer have that sweet deal. And the British population - those still alive at least - knew that. But so many old people had just enough nationalism left in them that as a fuck-you before they left this plane of existence, they just had to screw everyone over.
I really feel bad for especially Scotland though, because I think a big enough % of them voted no to independence just 2 years prior to the Brexit referendum because it meant staying in the EU, that had they known of the result beforehand they’d have definitely voted for freedom from those clowns in the south.Its a take.
You don’t like your current arrangements with the EU so you’re inclined to leave, and then reminded that if you ever join again we’re going to make the arrangements even worse and will drive even more tension. It will definitely make the union stronger.
The tone coming out of the EU and UK is more more collaborative and sounds more adult than the Junker years.
I just don’t see what we have to gain from being hardliners on this. And as you said, many of the people voting leave have died.
In practical terms, if your currency is pegged to the Euro there’s no difference to having the Euro. And many countries have partially-official Schengen deals or at least act like they do, control the borders they want to, etc.
It makes sense. A shift toward full integration can only come from within the UK. British economists are the ones who should explain that adopting the euro would be beneficial. Schengen is something the UK has to choose to discuss with Ireland and France.
Fuck Politico
I’d wait for statements rather than the word of two officials. It is the Commission, Parliament, and Council having a say on this. What a signal it would give to countries joining from the east too.
EUßerst bedenklich
nonononono
