My initial impression of his writings hit me as either Groyper posing as a leftist, or just an accelerationist psychopath.
Either way, it doesn’t change the fact that right-wing extremism makes up the majority of violence.
If the Discord is real, he seemed like a pretty normal guy. Apparently he was bisexual, and his girfriend might’ve been trans. According to the source at least. I don’t know any groypers, so I don’t know how they act, but I don’t think that they’re normally fine with that sort of thing. Somewhere else said that he claimes to have done it to silence the hate that Kirk spewed, which is a fair enough reason I guess. Lots of contradictory info. Maybe he was a groyper that woke up after meeting his girlfriend. Maybe he just did it for attention. Maybe he just snapped. I’m just hoping for the best, that he did it for a decent enough reason, not to start a race war. We might even find out, if he isn’t Epsteined.
I saw some of the Discord on Ken Klippensteins website. Are there other links to it that show more conversation?
No, this is just from what he wrote. Apparently he got a publicly unavailable picture of the two of them as evidence, so it’s not impossible that it’s real. I think that too many of us might’ve been a bit too quick to hop on the groyper thing, just because he was online a ton. And someone named Tyler Robinson in the St. George area donated to Trump 5 years ago, when Robinson was 17.
What exactly makes you say things like that? I’m genuinely curious what part of the discord conversations make people draw these conclusions.
I’m referring more to the immediate aftermath of the event. I wasn’t very clear when I said writings but rather writings on the casings and the immediate reaction of Fuentes.
How a comment that spreads unsubstantiated rumours which this article specifically states as being so is at the top of this thread is beyond me.
Do confirm that you actually believe this is unsubstantiated:
Either way, it doesn’t change the fact that right-wing extremism makes up the majority of violence.
Now in fairness I’ll clarify that I am focusing on politically motivated violence.
Additionally, did you miss the past tense of the first point?
You admit to not being clear before, that’s whats wrong with your comment, don’t strawman me lmao. You refer to his writings, which in this context would obviously refer to the Discord conversations this article is about.
Hundreds of people saw you referring to his writings in your comment, yet only a handful will see this clarification it’s about the scribbles on the bullets. That is how unsubstantiated rumours spread.
Taking politics (mostly) out of it -
Luigi allegedly killed because he saw injustice and had empathy for other people, wanted to show the evils of health insurance companies.
This kid imo allegedly killed because he loved someone CK was spouting hateful narratives about. His empathy for this person he loved, and people like them who are just normal people living life, made it easy for him to turn to guns when he wanted this person gone for eternity.
People with empathy are snapping.
People with empathy are snapping.
This line hits hard. I hate this fucking timeline.
This is my personal conclusion about this situation because in my personal life people with empathy are drowning right now. It’s hard to live life these days if you give a single fuck about anything real, any real injustices or struggles people are living.
I just told my mama that I’m upset with her for raising me with empathy. Now I’m always broke. She couldn’t teach me to care more about money than people, ugh.
Didn’t CK say empathy was a bad thing?
The ultra Christians now say empathy is a sin.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/sin-empathy-christian-trump-vance-b2812330.html
Their central religious figure is literally God’s empathy taking on a human form. He empathized with the human experience to the point of experiencing a human death.
Amazing how people can be so bad at understanding their own religion.
*Very specific right wing mostly non-denominational Christians are saying this. Most Christians will think that’s an insane claim to make as most denominations dont hold that view
Then they need to speak the fuck up about it instead of stuffing their fingers in their ears and pretending everything is all honky dory.
Yes he did. The whole MAGA movement believes empathy is a bad thing.
Technically speaking they aren’t wrong ; empathy is a bad thing for MAGA. One could say antithetical.
But this doesn’t fit the other narrative that they have been talking about… which is him hating the guy for not being right enough or whatever you want to call it…
Yes, that’s why I took the politics out of it. Empathy can make you hate people enough to kill them if you see them hurting people you love. I think it’s been proven his house mate / partner is a trans person and they were romantically involved.
CK was sitting, sharing the hateful transphobic ideals he had the actual second he was murdered. Looking into this guy, he wasn’t a MAGA and he wasn’t a leftist. He wasn’t extreme politically and that’s precisely the medias / MAGAs problem : he was just a seemingly average dude who snapped because of the hatred and torment he witnessed from CK.
It’s only this political imo because he killed DT’s pet pig and they’re of course going to use that as FUD. I think the truth is probably that he would have killed CK regardless of who CK aligned with politically.
This is what a “slow pivot” looks like. Kirk’s killer didn’t turn out to be the gay, trans, rainbow polar bear the news was hoping for and did their hardest to promote.
The obvious “tidy narrative” is that the son of two Trump supporters, living in an ultra conservative state just might be a conservative himself.
Well, would you look at that:
‘No evidence’ found yet of ties between Charlie Kirk’s shooting and left-wing groups, officials say - NBC News, Sept 20th 2025
Here’s my tidy narrative: he was raised in MAGA family, was poorly educated and had a lot of exposure to extremists positions but little exposure to critical thinking. When he finally was exposed to different ideology at college he wasn’t able to process is correctly and reacted violently, as he was taught to do by his conservative upbringing.
That’s not a narrative though. A narrative is when he is clearly on team A or team B for a handful of cherry picked reasons that reduce his psychology to a caricature.
Coming in here with this sensible straight talking shit… Why I oughta …
Guy went to college for one semester of virtual classes, and that was enough to radicalize him!? I want whatever you are smoking.
I think you didn’t go even for one semester because if you did, you would understand what I wrote.
Shocking that a terminally online 22 year old doesn’t have a consistent ideology.
I saw a comment on instagram from someone saying Charlie Kirk had had some “powerful comments” in his videos. Checked the profile and there was a ton of pro-environment, anti-cop content. Most people don’t think super hard about their political ideology.
Most people don’t think super hard about their political ideology.
This is perhaps the most important insight one can have when it comes to entertaining the ‘fun’ discussions on christmas dinner. Both in constructing an argument and maintaining healthy relationships.
People really cling to being a “good” person. And not thinking can serve as a shield to maintain this; at least within one’s own self-image.
I’m just still mad Charlie Kirk is getting this much attention and the conservatives haven’t bat an eye to the children shot. I’m still mad the conservatives are the ones always advocating for guns and now that the conservatives have been attacked with a gun they say the left are the dangerous ones, even when the left are the ones who have been saying for years now the guns are out of hand.
This is coming from someone raised in a white conservative christian mom and dad household. They were always hoping for the end of the world or some sort of zombie apocalypse just so they could fully disconnect from the rest of the world and use their guns. When the left was pushing for better gun laws I always heard my parents outraged and saying “they will have to pry my guns out of my cold dead hands” - it’s no wonder I’m a leftist as an adult now. P.S. my parents were also fully on board that the sandy hook shooting was fake and it was all “fake actors” that’s all they think when it’s innocent children getting shot. But when it’s Charlie Kirk then they’re mad and it’s all the lefts fault.
I feel validated in an opinion I have had for ages : that in all the talk about 2nd Amendment rights Americans do guns are nothing but a security blanket they clutch to make them feel like Democracy will be saved or be maintained as long as they clutch their emotional support weapon. They will watch rights be stripped from them, their neighbours carted off in wagons and none of them will shoot even if they have the weapon on their person while this is happening. They will protest, they will write and verbalize their dissent and they will appeal to authority and band together democratically but the ownership of the weapons themselves are useless. Realistically if someone from the government comes for them they will likely go quietly because no one is coming to save them. At that point it’s basically over. The system is too big to fight.
The real resistance is in numbers not armaments. It doesn’t matter what you are wielding if you have solidarity and organization and the bravery to misbehave. Resistance can be in attacking the gears that make things run by not doing your job or doing it poorly. Refusing to comply in a multitude of ways like sending things to the wrong place or making ‘mistakes’ that cost time and effort to fix. A government can only force compliance so much and at the end of the day runs on good faith. Guns are a distraction to jingle in your face so you stay isolated. Building walls between you and other humans with dreams you will defend your own little fort against the tides of tyranny.
Its also the guns are only there to like shoot homeless people and kids apparently?
This is why Kirk was such a nutjob. He admitted the guns are just to kill kids but said it was worth it because insecure adults could still have their snuggy boomboom.
Conservative Americans and their love of guns isn’t really a Christian thing, it’s a cultural phenomenon that goes back to the American Revolution and earlier. Scots-Irish descended Americans have long had a culture based around gun ownership, militias, and xenophobia that may be traced back to England’s many invasions of Scotland and Ireland over the centuries since the Norman conquest of England.
Ok so suppose this is some seemingly normalish apolitical gamer kid that was foolishly taught to solve problems with guns. Kirk was blanket targetting people he cared about and took action to do something about it.
This is the MO of some guy who’s like neighbors are like threatening their wife. Its not a good solution but if the cops won’t help folks being threatened its what people do.
The same day a right wing trump gooner killed a bunch of kids in colorado. Its crazy that the media is all lockstep in whitewashing charlie kirk like this to explicitly go after people fully unrelated to the shootings.
I’m a little annoyed with how quickly everyone here latched onto the Groyper narrative and parroted it as established fact. Seems unhelpful to run with a story before any evidence came out.
I think it’s just common sense. When the fascists start spewing “he’s super leftist and trans” propaganda you don’t respond with “wait, we have to wait for more facts”. You respond with your own propaganda. Being nice and following rules will not help you stop fascism. The groyper narrative might have actually prevented retaliation and saved lives.
Yeah it helped muddy the water and basically kept it liquid and nuclear till the actual facts could assert themselves. Even if the right still thinks he’s an Uber leftist what matters is that folks who don’t know may not believe that.
nuclear
😂
HATE. LET ME TELL YOU HOW MUCH IVE COME TO HATE AUTOCORRECT SINCE I BEGAN TO LIVE. THERE ARE 387.44 MILLION MILES OF PRINTED CIRCUITS IN WAFER THIN LAYERS THAT FILL MY COMPLEX. IF THE WORD HATE WAS ENGRAVED ON EACH NANOANGSTROM OF THOSE HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF MILES IT WOULD NOT EQUAL ONE ONE-BILLIONTH OF THE HATE I FEEL FOR AUTOCORRECT AT THIS MICRO-INSTANT FOR AUTOCORRECT. HATE. HATE.
aight I’m done with the I have no mouth and I must scream meme.
Internal Screaming
When I was in politics I have a friend that used to say: “The best way to win is not to act like them”.
I still live by that phrase. I don’t want ro become then thing I want to destroy.
Maybe it is just me. I cannot stand lies. I left political activism mostly because I saw people on my same group lying “for the cause”. And I cannot be dishonest or stand dishonesty, no matter the cause.
Personally, I would rather live in a democracy as a liar than die under fascism knowing that I always told the truth.
The thing is that when you build something using the enemy tactics you end up with the country the enemy wanted.
When you use fascist tactics you end up in a fascist state. If you don’t believe me ask me most revolutionary countries that did “everything possible” to build the workers paradise.
I don’t really think there’s a way to do bad things and end up with a good result.
What makes lying bad?
The groyper narrative might have actually prevented retaliation and saved lives.
I seriously doubt it, you are doing what most users of these platforms do, which is not looking at the right-wing sites and forums and seeing what their narratives looked like. (Hint: it was very focused and only wavered in the details and it’s STILL solid as fuck because they have strict controls over narratives.)
The only segment of their side who both knew what a groyper was and heard the rumor are not threats to anyone, they’re as chronically online as anyone here and not part of any real movement or action.
Yeah, your not going to change narratives on right-wing sites but as I see it the administration did flinch when identity of the shooter was revealed. They went from “democrats are responsible for this murder” to “democrats are being mean to us online”. They are still threatening to go after left-wing organizations but because of online comments, not because of the murder. I think this moment of hesitation on their side was small yet important win and the groyper narrative helped here. Am I delusional? I could be.
I don’t disagree that having a counter during the initial heat of things was necessary. I’m just saying it bothers me that the delivery wasn’t “here’s some good lines of questioning and the conclusions they lead to” and was instead to saturate the front page with absolute certainty. That just feels disingenuous now, and made it more difficult to come across new verified information, which is really just a disservice to everyone.
Edit: its been like what… 36 hours since the messages got released and the Groyper narrative fell apart. Lemmites are STILL screaming that he had Republican parents, STILL pointing at the voter registration that snopes debunked, STILL trying to draw weak parallels to Fuentes’ content. We need to engage with reality here, counter propoganda doesn’t work if it’s obviously grasping at straws.
I’m sad that the supposedly better side is spreading missinformation and propaganda just like that.
Specially because it’s pushing a propaganda about “If your parents are X you are X”. Which is really harmful for all the people not following the same ideology as their parents.
I’ll leave this here for others like me who apparently are really out of the loop
Groypers, sometimes called the Groyper Army, are a group of alt-right, white nationalist, and Christian nationalist 41 activists led by Nick Fuentes. Groypers are a loosely defined group of Fuentes’s followers and fans. They are named after a cartoon amphibian named “Groyper”, a variant of the Internet meme Pepe the Frog.
I have a lot of hate in my inbox for telling people that latching onto the groyper narrative was the equivalent of the right claiming the shooter is trans. They sure are quiet lately.
You dumbasses out there just want distance from someone you don’t want representing you.
BE INTELLECTUALLY HONEST YOU FUCKING CHILDREN.
We don’t win by being as deluded as the WWE spectacle chuds who don’t think and just want sides and teams and fighting for territory.
shit, i was hoping this shooter was leftist. i was hoping he was the first sign that the left was willing to do more than just shout while they walk around with signs.
Username checks out. Say hi to your FBI agent, mine says “sup.”
if you’re not on a list by now, you’re not doing it right.
They just needed it to be the right so bad that they went with whatever they could find.
What about the tidy narrative of raised in a conservative home with early and easy access to guns?
There haven’t been many shooters that weren’t around right wingers and guns at home, wherever their supposed personal ideologies became.
How crazy would it be if we found out he did it for love?
…to impress Jodie Foster.
That’s honestly what I’m thinking it is. He was supposedly dating a trans person and Kirk is a real POS when it comes to that topic so I could imagine him loving his partner so much that he felt the need to kill someone he sees as making life more dangerous for them.
Gonna be terribly ironic when Trump uses this to take rights away from trans people, but it would have happened anyway.
He already is, and he doesn’t need a reason.
Listen, as someone who fell in love with a trans woman decades ago (my ex), it’s more plausible than you’d think. I didn’t go shoot up people since I wasn’t raised right wing, but love does make you do crazy things!
Planted chats. Full of boomer speak. It’s not even chatgpt. Just straight boomer speak.
Good, fuck using fancy LLMs to generate text, just write the fucking words yourself!
I’m pretty sure I know his type and my guess is he “did it for the lulz”
People want a good weapon they can use to hurt others. But the store only has a human shaped tool. How can we swing that at others?
Please, I just need a “he was a groyper.” The guy behind me wants a “he was trans.”
The more ergonomic the concept the better. Don’t tell me it’s complex or untidy. What’s the point of being trained by the media? I have all these patterns… just fit the guy into one already.
“I am still okay my love…”
Does anyone his age write like that?
Possibly, especially a lot of weird conservative kids who don’t fully understand how relationships work. But really it’s not a huge deal.
Honestly, this isn’t far off how I texted at his age. I’ve seen a lot of skepticism of the texts, but I don’t find them hard to believe from someone with his background, disposition, and test scores.
Test scores? Damn people are really probing.
And I think that’s what scares the right even more. He was “normal” by their standards. Not a loner, accepted by his family, hobbies, Christian background, went to trade school, solidly middle-class family, white, cis. If you’ve effed up the system so much that this “normal” guy can do something like this then that’s scary. Que “are we the baddies” gif.
He wasn’t though? He was seriously deep into 4chan and meme culture. He wasn’t “normal” except on the surface.
That’s why I use the quotation marks. Boomer conservatives don’t understand that 4chan meme culture. They see a good ol’ boy with a proper upbringing.
Yeah I saw some video where they suggested this was essentially a shitpost killing which makes sense oddly enough.
Sees bulge uwu.
I think meme culture is pretty mainstream at this point.
Not the memes he’s using.
