ok so i’ve heard at least 2 different definitions of progress.
- one strictly defines progress as technological progress. the reasoning is that “progress” comes from latin “pro-gress” (marching forward) which refers to any labor process feeling very similar to a long march. exhausting.
- another nice angle i’ve heard was that “progress” is a play-on-words with progesterone which is a substance produced by biological women to advance various internal processes, as such it is understood as “what women do” or as women’s movement. it’s silly but i’ve heard it and now so have you.
especially, do you think that “progress” properly describes your goals? do you say that progress is what we need as a society? if no, how else would you describe your goals?
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I define progress as “drawing closer to achieving goals or meeting benchmarks as time moves forward” but that’s just off the cuff at the end of a long day
The first thing that comes to mind is Toyota’s philosophy of gradual improvement. Toyota cars sometimes fall behind with new technology but their caution ensures their cars are reliable and provide the best long term customer experience.
Another thing that comes to mind is the term “in progress” which is widely used in manufacturing and it just means that it’s being done. It’s not sophisticated or difficult to think about.
Progress is when stuff get more gooder over time
Like further increasing shareholder value, right?
Unironically yes, if you measure across a few business cycles.
Mr. Burns: “Excellent…”
Stonks.
For me, “progress” is any societal or technological change that helps society as a whole and reduces or removes inequality.
Examples of progress : ending slavery, women’s rights, worker’s rights, free quality education, LGBT+ rights and general acceptance and understanding, ending racism, the personal computer, internet, medecine, clean transportation, diplomacy, right to repair etc.
Exemples of absolutely NOT progress: conservatism, fascism and authoritarianism (several sides of the same coin), social media, LLMs (both being pushed by and controlled by and only benefitting technofascist feudalists), erosion of rights, mass surveillance etc.
Improvement, or changing the trend towards it (or less further away)
It’s a word, first of all. Cancer can progress, it doesn’t mean it’s in everyone’s best interest, lol.
Let’s just use the word “change”. Would the society I live in benedit from change? Certainly! In many aspects, and not so much in others (fish and chips and farmer markets can stay as they are, for example, but binge drinking, consumerism, extreme self-centeredness and hedonistic sexual practices should become a thing of the past and stay there).
And no, my main goal is to please God by being a prosocial element in the universe we’ve been given for free, as righteous and pious as I can be within reasonable expectations. In a way, it has necessitated personal progress, as I’ve had to learn to live with the emotional instability that comes with ADHD and childhood trauma, trying my best to remain calm and not explode/start swinging. I’ve learned to care about people even if their lives don’t impact me in any way, I’ve learned to be more flexible and understanding instead of just trying to impose my POV and disregard others as foolish nonsense. With God’s and my wife’s help, I feel like I’ve made much progress, and hopefully I still have more years to develop. But I’ve many other traits I’m pleased with and would not like to change, and others that aren’t problematic enough to be worth the effort of making changes.
As such, change/“progress” has been a means to an end, not the end by itself. And if your goal was just “progress”/change, how would you know when to stop? How would you measure success, either total or partial? 😅
How would you measure success, either total or partial? 😅
good question indeed
The opposite of congress.
This works on couple different levels, nice.
I’d like to give more focus to circular patterns. Instead of continuing the cancer-logic pattern of ‘line must go up’ that progress evokes, we could instead learn how repeating patterns shape our societies, and how we can create sustainable movement.
Edit: this was asking for the definition. So yeah, progress for me is a linear upwards movement.
When my code runs more than it doeant.
But Steve, that’s the “hello, world” example
Take it as granted that civilisation is improving over the long term. Then, “progress” is when that improvement happens.
If it’s not improving over the long term, progress is no longer a meaningful concept. There’s no real word for it in ancient languages, since people either thought everything was slowly getting worse, or perpetually staying about the same. (And honestly, was 1500AD better than 1500BC?)
Edit: Per the questions in the text, saying you want progress is just saying you believe in this kind of “whig history”, and you would like society to improve somewhat.
Any political and technological improvement that affects society at large.
Inventing a wheel? Progress. Forming tribes, kingdoms, republics? Progress.
But also improving the camera on your phone? Progress. Passing worker protection law in a city of 10000? Progress.
Small or big, both are examples of things, that are by themselves better. The only important caveat is when one contradicts the other.
Improved cameras being used to deport migrants? Not progress, as a technological improvement tramples political development. Emergence of an agrarian socialist state? Not progress, as political development is accompanied by the destruction of technology.
Each side to progress is only as useful and important as it is supported or at least not interfered by the other. Then it’s progress.
Emergence of an agrarian socialist state? Not progress
Eh, depends on motivation and effect.
Agrarian socialist state because automation bad, back to picks and hoes for you, must have full employment, not progress IMO.
Agrarian socialist state to lower greenhouse gas and environmental damage while going hard on solar and automation to give the workers low hours and guaranteed income to pursue art, science or just life (basically solarpunk), definitely progress IMO.
Kudos to OP, good question.
Yeah I was thinking more of Khmer Rouge scenario. Technically, communist. But boy it was neither good nor progressive.
All for sustainable technology, though!
Change that gives benefits. Be it for the individual or society.
Less discrimination means less suicides, more ideas in the ideas pool due to them not having to fear, and less growth of extremism
Edit: on an individual level: even if you failed a task, you now know how to re do it correctly. And do it better next time
The creation of new Pareto efficient alternatives.
a weapon of mass destruction… of whatever any group of people will consider a menace and want to dismiss by making it ‘hostile to progress’ (progress being themselves/their idea(l)s, obviously).
One generation is looking down on it’s parent generation (and maybe earlier generations too).
Each generation develops this attitude to some extent. “Progress” is a common term to pretty-paint or justify it.
Since the industrial revolution, the term was amended as “technical progress” with an extended meaning, but similar purpose.
Do you have an actual example of people talking about progress before the modern era? AFAIK they didn’t.
Reading skills anyone? I did not say they all talked about progress, I said they all had that attitude.
Okay, an example of that, then.
Hesiod thought every age was worse than the last, and you can find plenty of “kids these days” or “men were better back then” comments throughout the written record. The idea that everything is perfectly cyclical also crops up.
On the other hand, I can’t think of a single example of “the way my parents/ancestors did things was wrong”. The closest is maybe just a neutral observation that fashions change, or regret that a specific innovation isn’t taken up faster. TBF younger authors have to be less likely to be reproduced, but the difference is stark.
